OT Gen 9:2

TomWarren commented

2020-09-10 15:05:14 +00:00

The ULB currently reads:

\v 2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon every living animal on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything that goes low on the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea. They are given into your hand.

The highlighted section is a redundant conflation.

It could be every living thing, or every animal; but every living animal misses the mark.

The Suggestion for Gen 9:2 is:

\v 2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon every animal on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything that moves on the ground, and on all the fish in the sea. They are given into your hand.

The ULB currently reads: \v 2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon **every living animal** on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything that goes low on the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea. They are given into your hand. The highlighted section is a redundant conflation. It could be every **living thing**, or every **animal**; but every living animal misses the mark. The Suggestion for Gen 9:2 is: \v 2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon **every animal** on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything **that moves on the ground**, and on all the fish **in** the sea. They are given into your hand.

JohnH commented

2020-10-28 17:16:52 +00:00

Owner

The CSB and HCS have "every living creature." That is not too far removed from "every living animal," but perhaps it is redundant. I'm fine with Tom's suggestion.

that goes low on the ground versus that moves on the ground
I agree with Tom's suggestion

The CSB and HCS have "every living creature." That is not too far removed from "every living animal," but perhaps it is redundant. I'm fine with Tom's suggestion. **that goes low on the ground** versus **that moves on the ground** I agree with Tom's suggestion

JohnH added the

Drew

label 2020-10-28 17:17:16 +00:00

drewc commented

2020-10-28 17:18:45 +00:00

Owner

I like living thing and then clarify in the notes.

Agreed with the other suggestion.

I like living thing and then clarify in the notes. Agreed with the other suggestion.

JohnH commented

2020-10-29 15:37:26 +00:00

Owner

I just realized these phrases are used in several places earlier in Genesis. There we translated them as "beasts of the earth" and "everything that creeps upon the ground."

I think it would be good to make these the same. Would it be better to go back and change the earlier verses to "living thing" and "moves on the ground" or change 9:2 to match the earlier verses?

@drewcurley

I just realized these phrases are used in several places earlier in Genesis. There we translated them as "beasts of the earth" and "everything that creeps upon the ground." I think it would be good to make these the same. Would it be better to go back and change the earlier verses to "living thing" and "moves on the ground" or change 9:2 to match the earlier verses? @drewcurley

drewc commented

2020-10-29 16:57:09 +00:00

Owner

Can you give me verse references?

JohnH commented

2020-10-29 17:07:25 +00:00

Owner

1:9, 24, 25, 30

6:19-20 we translate as "every living creature of the flesh; every creeping thing of the ground"

"Creep" is used in 7: 8, 14

8:17, 19 have "every living creature; every creeping thing"

1:9, 24, 25, 30 6:19-20 we translate as "every living creature of the flesh; every creeping thing of the ground" "Creep" is used in 7: 8, 14 8:17, 19 have "every living creature; every creeping thing"

drewc commented

2020-10-29 17:13:08 +00:00

Owner

I don't think we can make it absolutely consistent. Some would be problematic because of the reference to birds, which are also living things. I think we would need to go through each of these individually.

JohnH commented

2020-10-29 18:05:05 +00:00

Owner

I will come back to this one.

JohnH commented

2020-10-29 20:18:44 +00:00

Owner

1:24 God said, "Let the earth produce living creatures נֶ֤פֶשׁ חַיָּה֙ each according to its own kind, livestock, creeping things וָרֶ֛מֶשׂ, and beasts of the earth חַיָּה֙ אֶ֖רֶץ, each according to its own kind." It was so.

1:25 God made the beasts of the earth חַיַּ֨ת הָאָ֜רֶץ after their kind, the livestock after their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground כָּל־רֶ֥מֶשׂ הָֽאֲדָמָ֖ה its kind. He saw that it was good.

1:26 God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. Let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the sky, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." כָּל־רֶ֥מֶשׂ הָֽאֲדָמָ֖ה הָֽרֹמֵ֥שׂ

1:28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful, and multiply. Fill the earth, and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the sky, and over every living thing that moves upon the earth." וּבְכָל־חַיָּ֖ה הָֽרֹמֶ֥שֶׂת

1:30 To every beast of the earth חַיַּ֨ת הָאָ֜רֶץ, to every bird of the heavens, and to everything that creeps וּלְכֹ֣ל רוֹמֵ֣שׂ upon the earth, and to every creature that has the breath of life I have given every green plant for food." It was so.

6:7 So Yahweh said, "I will wipe away mankind whom I have created from the surface of the earth—mankind and animals בְּהֵמָ֔ה, and creeping things רֶ֖מֶשׂ and birds of the heavens, for I regret that I have made them."

6:20 Of the birds after their kind, and of animals after their kind, of every creeping thing רֶ֖מֶשׂ of the ground after its kind, two of every sort will come to you to keep them alive.

7:4 For in seven days I will cause it to rain upon the earth for forty days and forty nights. I will destroy from off the surface of the ground every living thing הַיְקוּם֙ that I have made."

7:8 Clean animals and unclean animals הַ֨בְּהֵמָ֔ה, birds, and everything that creeps רֹמֵ֖שׂ upon the ground,

7:14 They entered along with each wild animal הַֽחַיָּ֣ה according to its kind, and each sort of livestock הַבְּהֵמָה֙ according to its kind, and each creeping thing that creeps הָרֹמֵ֥שׂ הָרֶ֛מֶשׂ upon the earth according to its kind, and every sort of bird according to its kind, each kind of creature with wings.

7:21 All living beings בָּשָׂ֣ר that moved הָרֹמֵ֣שׂ upon the earth died—birds, livestock בַבְּהֵמָה֙, wild animals וּבַ֣חַיָּ֔ה, all the living creatures that lived in great numbers הַשֹּׁרֵ֣ץ הַשֶּׁ֖רֶץ upon the earth, and all mankind.

7:23 So every living thing הַיְק֣וּם that was on the surface of the earth was wiped out, mankind and animals בְּהֵמָה֙ and creeping things רֶ֙מֶשׂ֙ and birds of the sky. They were all destroyed from the earth. Only Noah and those with him in the ark were left.

8:1 God remembered Noah, all the wild animals הַֽחַיָּה֙, and all the livestock הַבְּהֵמָ֔ה that were with him in the ark. God made a wind blow over the earth, and the waters started going down.

8:17 Take out with you every living creature הַחַיָּ֨ה of all flesh that is with you—the birds, the animals וּבַבְּהֵמָ֛ה, and every creeping thing that creeps הָרֹמֵ֥שׂ הָרֶ֛מֶשׂ upon the earth—so that they may increase greatly on the earth, that they may be fruitful and multiply upon the earth."

8:19 Every living creature הַֽחַיָּ֗ה, every creeping thing הָרֶ֙מֶשׂ֙, and every bird, everything that moves רוֹמֵ֣שׂ on the earth, according to their families, left the ark.

9:2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon every living thing חַיַּ֣ת on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything that moves תִּרְמֹ֧שׂ on the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea. They are given into your hand.

1:24 God said, "Let the earth produce living creatures נֶ֤פֶשׁ חַיָּה֙ each according to its own kind, livestock, creeping things וָרֶ֛מֶשׂ, and beasts of the earth חַיָּה֙ אֶ֖רֶץ, each according to its own kind." It was so. 1:25 God made the beasts of the earth חַיַּ֨ת הָאָ֜רֶץ after their kind, the livestock after their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground כָּל־רֶ֥מֶשׂ הָֽאֲדָמָ֖ה its kind. He saw that it was good. 1:26 God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. Let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the sky, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." כָּל־רֶ֥מֶשׂ הָֽאֲדָמָ֖ה הָֽרֹמֵ֥שׂ 1:28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful, and multiply. Fill the earth, and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the sky, and over every living thing that moves upon the earth." וּבְכָל־חַיָּ֖ה הָֽרֹמֶ֥שֶׂת 1:30 To every beast of the earth חַיַּ֨ת הָאָ֜רֶץ, to every bird of the heavens, and to everything that creeps וּלְכֹ֣ל רוֹמֵ֣שׂ upon the earth, and to every creature that has the breath of life I have given every green plant for food." It was so. 6:7 So Yahweh said, "I will wipe away mankind whom I have created from the surface of the earth—mankind and animals בְּהֵמָ֔ה, and creeping things רֶ֖מֶשׂ and birds of the heavens, for I regret that I have made them." 6:20 Of the birds after their kind, and of animals after their kind, of every creeping thing רֶ֖מֶשׂ of the ground after its kind, two of every sort will come to you to keep them alive. 7:4 For in seven days I will cause it to rain upon the earth for forty days and forty nights. I will destroy from off the surface of the ground every living thing הַיְקוּם֙ that I have made." 7:8 Clean animals and unclean animals הַ֨בְּהֵמָ֔ה, birds, and everything that creeps רֹמֵ֖שׂ upon the ground, 7:14 They entered along with each wild animal הַֽחַיָּ֣ה according to its kind, and each sort of livestock הַבְּהֵמָה֙ according to its kind, and each creeping thing that creeps הָרֹמֵ֥שׂ הָרֶ֛מֶשׂ upon the earth according to its kind, and every sort of bird according to its kind, each kind of creature with wings. 7:21 All living beings בָּשָׂ֣ר that moved הָרֹמֵ֣שׂ upon the earth died—birds, livestock בַבְּהֵמָה֙, wild animals וּבַ֣חַיָּ֔ה, all the living creatures that lived in great numbers הַשֹּׁרֵ֣ץ הַשֶּׁ֖רֶץ upon the earth, and all mankind. 7:23 So every living thing הַיְק֣וּם that was on the surface of the earth was wiped out, mankind and animals בְּהֵמָה֙ and creeping things רֶ֙מֶשׂ֙ and birds of the sky. They were all destroyed from the earth. Only Noah and those with him in the ark were left. 8:1 God remembered Noah, all the wild animals הַֽחַיָּה֙, and all the livestock הַבְּהֵמָ֔ה that were with him in the ark. God made a wind blow over the earth, and the waters started going down. 8:17 Take out with you every living creature הַחַיָּ֨ה of all flesh that is with you—the birds, the animals וּבַבְּהֵמָ֛ה, and every creeping thing that creeps הָרֹמֵ֥שׂ הָרֶ֛מֶשׂ upon the earth—so that they may increase greatly on the earth, that they may be fruitful and multiply upon the earth." 8:19 Every living creature הַֽחַיָּ֗ה, every creeping thing הָרֶ֙מֶשׂ֙, and every bird, everything that moves רוֹמֵ֣שׂ on the earth, according to their families, left the ark. 9:2 The fear of you and the dread of you will be upon every living thing חַיַּ֣ת on the earth, upon every bird of the sky, upon everything that moves תִּרְמֹ֧שׂ on the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea. They are given into your hand.

JohnH commented

2020-10-29 21:03:49 +00:00

Owner

Looking at the Hebrew, other translations, and our tN's, I think overall the ULB is adequate.

My suggestions:

1:25 the livestock after their kinds to kind to match the wording of the other phrases.

Change "beasts of the earth" to "wild animals" when paired with "livestock." 1:24, 25 (compare with 7:14, 21; 8:1

Looking at the Hebrew, other translations, and our tN's, I think overall the ULB is adequate. My suggestions: 1:25 the livestock after their **kinds** to **kind** to match the wording of the other phrases. Change "beasts of the earth" to "wild animals" when paired with "livestock." 1:24, 25 (compare with 7:14, 21; 8:1

drewc commented

2020-10-29 23:54:41 +00:00

Owner

Agreed, thank, I know that was some work.