Last Review ULB Ezr 9:9

TomWarren commented

2020-08-18 17:37:35 +00:00

ULB Ezr 9:9 currently reads:

\v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. Instead, he has extended covenant faithfulness to us. He has done this in the sight of the king of Persia in order to give us new strength, so we could rebuild the house of our God and raise its ruins. He did this so that he could give us a wall of safety in Judah and Jerusalem.

ULB Ezr 9:9 suggested changes:

\v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery, but he has extended to us his covenant faithfulness before the kings of Persia. He has granted us new life to rebuild the house of our God and repair its ruins, and he has given us a wall of protection in Judah and Jerusalem.

Tom W

ULB Ezr 9:9 currently reads: \v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. **Instead, he** has extended **covenant faithfulness to us**. **He has done this in the sight of** the king of Persia **in order to give us** new **strength, so we could rebuild** the house of our God and **raise** its ruins. **He did this so that he could give** us a wall of **safety** in Judah and Jerusalem. ULB Ezr 9:9 suggested changes: \v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery, **but he** has extended **to us his covenant faithfulness** **before** the kings of Persia. **He has granted us** new **life to rebuild** the house of our God and **repair** its ruins, **and he has given** us a wall of **protection** in Judah and Jerusalem. Tom W

SusanQuigley commented

2020-10-20 18:09:11 +00:00

Owner

"Instead" vs "but"
Hebrew: וַֽ
Instead: NLT, ISV, GWT
Change to Rather?

"covenant faithfulness to us" vs "to us his covenant faithfulness"
Heb does not have "his."
ULB is adequate

"He has done this in the sight of the king of Persia," vs "before the kings of Persia.
Suggestion is simpler.

"in order to give us new strength," vs "He has granted us new life"
ULB structure is more literal.
מִֽחְיָ֗ה - preservation of life, sustenance
Other versions have "to give us new life" or "to revive"
Suggestion is simpler.
"new strength" is adequate in the context of rebuilding

"the king" vs "the kings"
The suggestion is accurate.

"so we could rebuild the house" vs "to rebuild the house"
Suggestion is simpler.

"raise its ruins" vs "repair its ruins"
ULB is literal to the primary sense of the word.
"raise" - NET
Most versions have "repair" or "restore"
ULB is adequate as long as we have a tN.

"He did this so that he could give us" vs "and he has given us"
וְלָֽתֶת־ לָ֣נוּ 'and to give us'
Change to "and to give us"

"a wall of safety" vs "a wall of protection"
ULB is adequate

\v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. Rather, he has extended covenant faithfulness to us in the sight of the kings of Persia. He has done this in order to give us new strength to rebuild the house of our God and raise its ruins, and to give us a wall of safety in Judah and Jerusalem.

"Instead" vs "but" Hebrew: וַֽ Instead: NLT, ISV, GWT **Change to Rather?** "covenant faithfulness to us" vs "to us his covenant faithfulness" Heb does not have "his." **ULB is adequate** "He has done this in the sight of the king of Persia," vs "before the kings of Persia. **Suggestion is simpler.** "in order to give us new strength," vs "He has granted us new life" ULB structure is more literal. מִֽחְיָ֗ה - preservation of life, sustenance Other versions have "to give us new life" or "to revive" **Suggestion is simpler.** **"new strength" is adequate in the context of rebuilding** "the king" vs "the kings" **The suggestion is accurate.** "so we could rebuild the house" vs "to rebuild the house" **Suggestion is simpler.** "raise its ruins" vs "repair its ruins" ULB is literal to the primary sense of the word. "raise" - NET Most versions have "repair" or "restore" **ULB is adequate** as long as we have a tN. "He did this so that he could give us" vs "and he has given us" וְלָֽתֶת־ לָ֣נוּ 'and to give us' **Change to "and to give us"** "a wall of safety" vs "a wall of protection" **ULB is adequate** \v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. **Rather**, he has extended covenant faithfulness **to us in the sight** of the **kings** of Persia. **He has done this in order to give us** new strength **to rebuild** the house of our God and raise its ruins, **and to give** us a wall of safety in Judah and Jerusalem.

SusanQuigley added the

Drew

label 2020-10-20 18:09:17 +00:00

drewc commented

2020-10-20 20:36:23 +00:00

Owner

Is "before the kings of Persia" simpler, I wondered because it introduces a metaphor. Perhaps we could say "in front of" if you like that better. Other than that I agree.

SusanQuigley commented

2020-11-02 22:17:39 +00:00

Owner

I think I meant to suggest changing "in the sight of the kings of Persia" to "before the kings of Persia", but I'm fine with it either way. I see both in other translations.

I don't see any metaphor, but I see "in the sight of someone" as a way of explaining why "before someone" is significant -- the person can see it.

Which do you prefer? I didn't understand what you wrote above.

I think I meant to suggest changing "in the sight of the kings of Persia" to "before the kings of Persia", but I'm fine with it either way. I see both in other translations. I don't see any metaphor, but I see "in the sight of someone" as a way of explaining why "before someone" is significant -- the person can see it. Which do you prefer? I didn't understand what you wrote above.

drewc commented

2020-11-02 22:28:12 +00:00

Owner

I meant did not mean it is a literal metaphor. I was intending really to say that the first instinct of "before" is chronological. Changing it to before while simpler in phrasing is more complex in the sense that it is more abstract. I am afraid that the "in front of" sense of before will be difficult for L2 speakers.

My suggestion: Keep it as before the kings. Then add in front/the sight of as AT.

I meant did not mean it is a literal metaphor. I was intending really to say that the first instinct of "before" is chronological. Changing it to before while simpler in phrasing is more complex in the sense that it is more abstract. I am afraid that the "in front of" sense of before will be difficult for L2 speakers. My suggestion: Keep it as before the kings. Then add in front/the sight of as AT.

SusanQuigley commented

2020-11-03 16:23:48 +00:00

Owner

Ok. Thanks.
I realize I got confused with what I was doing when I was looking at each change. What would you think of this?

Changing "Instead" to "Rather"
Changing "in the sight of" to "before"
Changing the clause typos to match Tom's.
Otherwise keeping the original ULB vocabulary.

\v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. Rather he** has extended covenant faithfulness to us before the kings of Persia. He has given us new strength to rebuild the house of our God and raise its ruins, and he has given us a wall of safety in Judah and Jerusalem.

Ok. Thanks. I realize I got confused with what I was doing when I was looking at each change. What would you think of this? Changing "Instead" to "Rather" Changing "in the sight of" to "before" Changing the clause typos to match Tom's. Otherwise keeping the original ULB vocabulary. \v 9 For we are slaves, but our God has not forgotten us in our slavery. **Rather** he** has extended covenant faithfulness to us **before** the kings of Persia. **He has given** us new strength **to rebuild** the house of our God and raise its ruins, **and he has given** us a wall of **safety** in Judah and Jerusalem.

drewc commented

2020-11-03 16:31:11 +00:00

Owner

Agreed

SusanQuigley commented

2020-11-03 19:00:51 +00:00

Owner

I made the ULB changes and updated TN.

SusanQuigley closed this issue

2020-11-03 19:00:59 +00:00

Last Review ULB Ezr 9:9 #717