EST 4:3 sackcloth and ashes #11

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opened 2019-11-08 14:37:31 +00:00 by bobj · 4 comments

bobj commented

2019-11-08 14:37:31 +00:00

\v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. Many of them lay, dressed in sackcloth and sat in ashes.

Issues with the last sentence:

Poor grammar
It appears to give the wrong word picture; UBS indicates the image seems to be that the people lay on sackcloth covered with ashes. Cp ISA 58:5 "Is this really the kind of fast that I would want: A day for anybody to humble himself, for him to bow down his head like a reed, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under himself?" (ULB)
The AT in the tNote for this verse is similar to the UDB also: "Many of them were on the ground, dressed in sackcloth and sitting in ashes."

The ULB (same as ESV, NIV11) is more literal and has a word picture consistent with the UBS comment; i.e., \v 3 ... Many of them lay in sackcloth and ashes.

Suggested changes:

Change UDB to something like \v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. Many of them lay down on sackcloth that was covered with ashes.
Modify or delete the corresponding tNote.

\v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. **Many of them lay, dressed in sackcloth and sat in ashes.** Issues with the last sentence: * Poor grammar * It appears to give the wrong word picture; UBS indicates the image seems to be that the people lay on sackcloth covered with ashes. Cp ISA 58:5 "Is this really the kind of fast that I would want: A day for anybody to humble himself, for him to bow down his head like a reed, and to spread sackcloth and ashes under himself?" (ULB) * The AT in the tNote for this verse is similar to the UDB also: "Many of them were on the ground, dressed in sackcloth and sitting in ashes." The ULB (same as ESV, NIV11) is more literal and has a word picture consistent with the UBS comment; i.e., \v 3 ... **Many of them lay in sackcloth and ashes.** Suggested changes: * Change UDB to something like \v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. **Many of them lay down on sackcloth that was covered with ashes.** * Modify or delete the corresponding tNote.

SusanQuigley commented

2019-11-08 18:28:10 +00:00

Owner

Bob's suggested change to the ULB sounds good to me.
How about a possible meanings note?

Many of them lay in sackcloth and ashes - Possible meanings are 1) they put sackcloth and ashes on the ground and lay down on them or 2) they wore sackcloth and lay down on ashes.

Bob's suggested change to the ULB sounds good to me. How about a possible meanings note? **Many of them lay in sackcloth and ashes** - Possible meanings are 1) they put sackcloth and ashes on the ground and lay down on them or 2) they wore sackcloth and lay down on ashes.

TomWarren commented

2019-11-09 00:11:49 +00:00

Thanks Bob and Susan.

The UDB of EST 4:3 now reads:

\v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. Many of them lay down on sackcloth that was covered with ashes.

Thanks Bob.

And Susan's suggestion on the tN would be useful for those reading and translating this section.

Shall I apply it on Monday? If you apply the change, just close this out, or I will apply it and then close it then.

Thanks.

Tom

Thanks Bob and Susan. The UDB of EST 4:3 now reads: \v 3 In every province of the empire, when the letter from the king was read to the Jewish people, they cried and mourned. They fasted, wailed loudly, and were filled with sorrow. Many of them lay down on sackcloth that was covered with ashes. Thanks Bob. And Susan's suggestion on the tN would be useful for those reading and translating this section. Shall I apply it on Monday? If you apply the change, just close this out, or I will apply it and then close it then. Thanks. Tom